2011 Results

[PJW]

I have been given some other good news by two of our other members who didn't post directly themselves due in one case to technical issues and in the other feelings that it would be inappropriate:

I got a D for Module 2 and a C for module 3 so very happy with those results

Got my results today and passed all 4 modules. Absolutely delighted

Obviously it would be nice to think that those who frequent this website do much better on average than those who don't; however it probably isn't quite as rosy as all that. It is only natural that people are much more likely to post results of which they are proud, than those with which they are less happy.

There is no gettting away from there are a large number of disappointing results and I really would like to have a better understanding of why. Even if you don't want to post publicly here, do consider getting in touch with me directly. Interested in any feedback from candidates who didn't pass, but as suggestions of usseful information include:

a) prior to taking the exam how did you think you'd do?
b) having just written the exam paper, how did you then feel you had done?
c) in retrospect can you understand the result or did it come as a shock?
d) do you have any idea of any area of weakness?
e) is there anything about the exam itself that you feel is unfair / unduly difficult?
f) how could the Study Packs be improved to help ?
g) was any form of training available / did you participated in any Study Group?
h) how you tried to prepare for the exam- was it primarily by reading sources, using this Forum to look at attempted answers, practising own own attempts, getting work reviewed by more senior / experienced colleagues?

I would really like to help solve the problem which obviously exists, but at present I don't quite know what it is. There is far too high a failure rate (internationally certainly including the UK but I suspect particularly affecting those from other countries); something therefore is wrong somewhere but I don't have much information at present to determine. I need some data and it is those who have just scored N or F who are in a position to share from their perspective.

It must be particularly disheartening to get N's in multiple modules; so nearly but not quite good enough. Remember that if you have got any "N" then you can request the IRSE to give you a little feedback concerning your attempt at that module, giving some hint of why you didn't quite score enough to pass.

It does seem as if the particular difficulty with module 1 was actually not associated with it requiring only two questions to be answered rather than the three of most other modules; I must admit my theory appears to have been wrong. I never thought it was the only factor; certainly I believe that lack of adequate breadth of experience is a primary one, but I had thought it was contributory. Any other ideas?

How much the decline in module 3 results reflect:
a) the conscious decision to lower the emphasis on Control Tables (felt not to test adequately a candidate's true understanding) and thus could have been expected due the exam becoming a better filter,
or
b) how much it might be that a significant number of candidates didn't even realise that Control Tables only now count as a single question so therefore only did them plus one written question
we'll just have to wait another month to discover from the Exam Review.

I'm impressed with the number of C and Ds shown here.

Well done all of you and hope those that did not quite get all they wanted can dust themselves off and have another go soon.

Peter

[PJW]

Thank you for being brave and also for the feedback.

Does seem you were doing things right in your preparation, so I can see why you are disappointed. On the face of it, I don't understand your results either. It is good to know though that you are not disheartened and will try again.

I wonder whether it is sometime since you have done other exams; exam technique is pretty important and those who are in their young 20s not long out of university tend to do diproportionally well- i.e. what they lack in railway experience is more than compensated by them still being "exam passing machines". It may be that it is the pressure of getting things done in the time allowed that may be a difficulty- as you say you are having to think too much and perhaps using up too much time. Against this you have obviously practiced against the clock and can write enough for the written questions, so it isn't simply that. The one thing that I would point out is that despite your other contributions to this Forum, you haven't submitted your efforts for scrutiny here. Perhaps that is because you can get this done more suitably by your local mentor which would probably be even better, but it could indicate that you weren't getting feedback on your efforts as a matter of routine and hence might have thought you doing better than you actually were.

Re specific point on the Control Tables; I personally used to feel that it would be better to do most CTs well even if that meant omitting one as demonstrating better knowledge and understanding. However I do gather from the examiners that there are marks for each CT, so on that basis then the better technique is "the low hanging fruit" on all of the CTs. Hence think you got that approach correct.

Module 2 does seem particularly odd result given your initial feelings and also that the pass rate this year is actually quite high. Guessing of course, but the most likelyexplanation would be that you had failed to comprehend the notes about operational moves required on the layout etc and therefore't provide appropriate signalling, either as couldn't run the train service needed or provided far more facilities than could be justified. That would be an explantion why you left thinking it was in the bag (i.e. obviusly comfortable with the level of completion and unaware it presented you with something you didn't know how to handle). Otherwise can only think that you perpetuated loads of howlers re issing trap points, not providing sigals to protect conflicts, having insufficient brking between caution and stop signals etc; this is pretty unlikely if you have been studying the Study Pack I feel.

RE feedback- the IRSE is quite adamant that they will not consider giving papers back or individual feedback, other than that limited info available for people getting an "N".
I can see both sides:
a) why unsuccessful candidates would like
b) why IRSE doesn't want to go down that road.
To be honest, you wouldn't expect a univesity or a schools examination board to do so, would you? [Actually don't answer that question! Judging by the recent allegations about certain UK exam board examiners tipping off school teachers about which questions were going to come up in forthcoming exams, one dreads to think what one should expect!]

So the only option really is the Exam Review meeting where we can expect an overall summary and identification of common errors / where people lost marks. They won't get drawn into individual cases, but you most certainly ask your question re how best to utilise your available time if unable to complete all CTs. Also could get them to comment in reasonably general terms whether it was the CTs or the written questions that were weak. If there is something specific to that particular year's paper (e.g. you didn't know what to show for possible flank locking with a switch diamond) then you can certainly ask that sort of thing.

If there is a group with a specific detailed interest then can sometimes persuade a particular examiner to attend a local study group to give a session. There is a limited time window in which this is possible (typically Feb & March) because then start compiling next year's paper. Perhaps that is something that we could request- for example in the Signet offices at Derby and this might also make it possible for different people than can easily attend the London session to get some feedback.
Any way, it is Christmas; this is one for next year!

Disappointing results for me to say the least! Didn't pass M2 or M3
Obviously I'm not quite up to scratch as yet. Not too much of a big deal, it has always been a goal to work towards for me, not the decoration of the MIRSE, so my CPD will continue down the same path to try again next year.
To give some feedback PJW.

[pieman31]

A mixed bag for me, which left me rather confused :-S

Mod 1 - Fail
Mod 5 - Pass

My confusion lies in that I felt one module was alarmingly more difficult than the other! And not in the order my results suggest either. Applying a pessimistic view, I should count myself lucky not to have two fails! But hey ho......

Feedback for PJW

a) prior to taking the exam how did you think you'd do?
Having set myself a robust study plan, then totally not sticking to it and the fact that I registered for the exams very late I felt that I might be in trouble....

b) having just written the exam paper, how did you then feel you had done?
I was happy with Mod 1, having recently spent a few years in an Operations role I felt confident that I had tackled my chosen questions reasonably well....

Mod 5, on the other hand I was more unsure of.

c) in retrospect can you understand the result or did it come as a shock?
I can't understand the result for Mod 1 and it did shock me a little. Perhaps more will come to light after the exam review and when the paper is released. However, the Mod 5 result was a nice suprise in contrast.

d) do you have any idea of any area of weakness?
Yes and no. Yes, I feel I need more experience in safety engineering full stop. No, I don't know what areas to concentrate on to pass Mod 1.....

e) is there anything about the exam itself that you feel is unfair / unduly difficult?
No I felt the exam was well run. I had no suprises from the information given in the examination guide.

f) how could the Study Packs be improved to help ?
I'm not sure of the suitability of the study packs having not used them extensively.

g) was any form of training available / did you participated in any Study Group?
I did a yellow book course through NR. I didn't to any study groups, not that its any excuse, I find getting out of South Wales to attend such groups a logistical nightmare (and expensive too!)

h) how you tried to prepare for the exam- was it primarily by reading sources, using this Forum to look at attempted answers, practising own own attempts, getting work reviewed by more senior / experienced colleagues?
To be brutally honest, I was under-prepared for this exam. A mistke I dont plan on making twice! Although in my opinion, attempting past papers and having the work reviewed and critiqued by experienced peers seems the logical way forward.

[PJW]

Thanks for the feedback.

Also for the reminder that the papers have not yet been made available on the IRSE website; I did prompt ast year but will give a further nudge to get them out in time for the Exam Review.

The fact that you did not use the Study Guides a lot itself tells us something. Since they are now given to each student when registering for the exam, it suggests that you considered perhaps-
a) unnecessary for someone in your situation, or
b) unattractive to start to use, or
c) not useful having attempted to use.

Since you were not able to attend a Study Group that then rasies the question what you did use. I think few people work through much of the Reading List (and I can hardly say i blame them)- if you restricted yourself to Yellow Book then that might explain your mod 1 result; you had quite possibly covered that element well (and therefore felt you had done ok) but had not learnt enough re how the somewhat abstract theory in this is applied in the railway environment.

Do think experience is an important element; I guess that your years in maintenance will have helped more for mod 5 than mod 1. I agree that operational experience is useful for certain mod 1 questions, so can understand your surprise but I think that you may be right that lack of experience in safety engineering would be significant. A Yellow Book course is certainly useful but it is one thing to attend a course and another to have the familiarity that comes from putting into practice. Certainly I would recommend more practising of answering exam questions....

I take your point re the cost of travelling; this is certainly a worsening from the old British Rail days when staff had a certain amount of free travel and could generally get additional tickets for attendance at useful development events etc.

See if you can get your management to grant you the time and fund the journey to the YM half day seminar and exam review, whilst they are still full of seasonal goodwill!

A mixed bag for me, which left me rather confused :-S

Mod 1 - Fail
Mod 5 - Pass

My confusion lies in that I felt one module was alarmingly more difficult than the other! And not in the order my results suggest either. Applying a pessimistic view, I should count myself lucky not to have two fails! But hey ho......

Feedback for PJW

a) prior to taking the exam how did you think you'd do?
Having set myself a robust study plan, then totally not sticking to it and the fact that I registered for the exams very late I felt that I might be in trouble....

b) having just written the exam paper, how did you then feel you had done?
I was happy with Mod 1, having recently spent a few years in an Operations role I felt confident that I had tackled my chosen questions reasonably well....

Mod 5, on the other hand I was more unsure of.

c) in retrospect can you understand the result or did it come as a shock?
I can't understand the result for Mod 1 and it did shock me a little. Perhaps more will come to light after the exam review and when the paper is released. However, the Mod 5 result was a nice suprise in contrast.

d) do you have any idea of any area of weakness?
Yes and no. Yes, I feel I need more experience in safety engineering full stop. No, I don't know what areas to concentrate on to pass Mod 1.....

e) is there anything about the exam itself that you feel is unfair / unduly difficult?
No I felt the exam was well run. I had no suprises from the information given in the examination guide.

f) how could the Study Packs be improved to help ?
I'm not sure of the suitability of the study packs having not used them extensively.

g) was any form of training available / did you participated in any Study Group?
I did a yellow book course through NR. I didn't to any study groups, not that its any excuse, I find getting out of South Wales to attend such groups a logistical nightmare (and expensive too!)

h) how you tried to prepare for the exam- was it primarily by reading sources, using this Forum to look at attempted answers, practising own own attempts, getting work reviewed by more senior / experienced colleagues?
To be brutally honest, I was under-prepared for this exam. A mistke I dont plan on making twice! Although in my opinion, attempting past papers and having the work reviewed and critiqued by experienced peers seems the logical way forward.

[Jerry1237]

A mixed bag for me, which left me rather confused :-S

Mod 1 - Fail
Mod 5 - Pass

My confusion lies in that I felt one module was alarmingly more difficult than the other! And not in the order my results suggest either. Applying a pessimistic view, I should count myself lucky not to have two fails! But hey ho......

<snip>

What you've said actually supports your results. Mod 5 was harder, I would suggest, due to your deeper understanding of the subject and hence your brain has more to process. It seems harder.

Mod 1 is something that is gleened from working with safety. It is easy to miss the point with Mods 1/7 or to not fully understand the questioner's gists.

Out of curiousity, what where your learning mechanisms for both modules?

Well done with M5. Feel free to post precis answers for your M1 questions if you'd like some pointers.

[pieman31]

A mixed bag for me, which left me rather confused :-S

Mod 1 - Fail
Mod 5 - Pass

My confusion lies in that I felt one module was alarmingly more difficult than the other! And not in the order my results suggest either. Applying a pessimistic view, I should count myself lucky not to have two fails! But hey ho......

<snip>

Out of curiousity, what where your learning mechanisms for both modules?

In all honesty my preperation was poor. I had set myself a study plan, but in hindsight it was flawed. I only signed up for the exams at the last minute and thus left time enough only to study for one module. I think because I set myself some harsh targets I didn't really get motivated to get anything done and ended up getting very little study under my belt!!!

[Jerry1237]

@pieman31:

Don't beat yourself up. The exam isn't easy. One pass is very respecatable.